Random story from the interview trenches

In an interivew, I was asked:

"Which modern Supreme Court decision would you change, and why?"

("Modern" means no fair picking something about segregation or slavery that has been since overruled.)

Apparently it was meant to be a trick question . . . they didn't expect an answer, just wanted to see how I'd react to a stress question. Some people stammer, others politely ask for a moment to think it over and as likely as not come up with a response, and others ramble on about the judiciary or stare decisis.

Wish you could have seen the look of shock when I actually flat-out answered.

(I never did understand why the Court granted cert. in the Bong Hits 4 Jesus case. Are there better answers? Definitely. But it made for a good discussion.)

Quick! Answer!! No fair actually thinking!!

Job update

I got one.

Mid-sized firm that does exactly the kind of law I hope to practice. I anticipate a really good summer. And on the off chance I'm miserable, I have learned something else about what I don't want to do, which is important in itself. So either way, I win.

I got my resume read by reaching out to a recent-ish alum, who it turned out was on the hiring committee. The alum did some checking up on me -- calling friends of his who are friends of mine and my externship. I guess it helped.

And because I don't talk about Work Club, you probably won't hear more details than that.

But I am happy.

LOL-Reject

It took the government long enough!

So, Crazy Cat Lady of Aug. 31, finally got around to sending the rejection... by email.

Rejection...

... yes, again.

You know... I don't think I want to write about this anymore.

Alumni networking event

. . . is coming up. Many of the people on the list either met me in initial on-campus interviews and didn't grant me a callback, or met me at a callback somewhere I didn't get an offer.

I would so love to go, knowing I had an offer someplace really awesome so I could chat from a position of strength.

Instead, no offers and literally one prospect in the hopper (yeah, I've gotten more rejections since I last wrote.)

So I'm going to go anyway because ya never know.

But I'm not looking forward to it.

Goodies

Interview yesterday went well. Oddly, I met entirely with men. Usually firms make an effort to have you meet with a few women, especially when you're a woman. You know... to prove they have some. Here, not so much. But I liked the place anyway. Hope I get this one.

My anniversary was this week. We're going out this weekend -- its going to be terrific. Dinner and show and a trip to my favorite museum.

My most enjoyable class this semester is tax. That is NOT a function of any love I have of tax. Its a function of enjoying my other classes less. But Tax was the only class I went to yesterday, so that was a goodie.

Buoy

Just got an offer . . . for a round of interviews from a firm that didn't do OCI but invited us to resume drop. So that's something. Keep your fingers crossed. I'll keep you posted.

Edited: eh, what I get for being cute. I got another interview, folks. A "callback" ... I guess, though its a first interview. Its not an offer.

To the person who found my blog searching for "six callbacks no offers," I am sorry you didn't find answers here. I suggest starting a blog. No, it won't net you any offers. But you'll feel better when people find your blog searching for "eight callbacks no offers." Cuz that person would be a loser. *ahem*

To the person who found my blog searching for "business associations law school sucks," I am also sorry you didn't find answers here. I suggest taking up drinking. In class. A shot whenever the word "derivitive" is used would be a good start.

Specpertive

That's perspective, looking a bit backward and a bit forward.

I listened to some 1Ls freaking out on the shuttle yesterday and realized the sounded exactly like I did. It made me smile a bit, and I realized I have really no bitterness left over 1L. I've moved on.

I hope I'm sitting on the shuttle next fall, with a post-grad plan, listening to the 2Ls freaking out about OCI and such. I hope I can smile, knowing that its all going to be ok for them... and for me.

I hope.

Invested

Query: Do I want a law firm job? Seriously?

I didn't when I started law school. But I also didn't want to rule anything out without having a good understanding of the pros and cons. And I enjoyed my job this past summer, although it wasn't at a firm, and it was definitely not the kind of thing I ever saw myself doing.

Answer: So yes. I really think I'd like to work for a firm, at least for next summer, just to see.


Apparently, the firms disagree.

I am seriously afraid I am going to have gone through this whole thing for nothing.

No offers yet. Lots of rejections. Very little left in "limbo."

I think I must have blown it during the few callbacks I had.

And its depressing the heck out of me.

I've gotten very invested in this process. And its paying out dividends -- like bruised ego, crushing disappointment, and a sense of futility.

I'm a "hell no"

I think candidates that are called back fall into three piles:

Offer immediately

Ok, I could maybe see them working here, lets see who else we get in this process before we decide... and see if any of our "offer immediatelys" actually accept.

Hell no, reject immediately.

After six callbacks, I fall into the second category at at least three firms, because I haven't heard one way or the other yet.

At two firms, its too soon to tell.

Yesterday, I got a Hell No letter from what I perceived as my best all-around interview. That interview was Wednesday afternoon.

They must have mailed the rejection before the door hit my ass on the way out.

Awesome.





(*I AM ok with this. Amused, really.)

Light

The light at the end of the tunnel.

My final callback is this afternoon.

I think I can feel the clouds parting.

Of course, if I don't get any offers, its back to the drawing board.

Boring

I don't like the person I am becoming right now, going through this OCI process. I don't like talking about myself all the time. I don't like begging for a job I am not sure I want. I don't like being compelled to justify my decision to attend the law school I did. I don't like explaining that Yes, I really am a full time day student -- that my law school accepted its smallest incoming class ever as part of an effort to move up in the rankings because you firms will only talk to the top 10 people in the class (maybe) from our school even though there are many bright capable people who fall outside that range because of the g-ddamned rankings.

Interviewers seem to think I did 'ok' grade-wise, but they want the dirt on the classes I did less well in. Can I really tell them -- I spent half of 1L as a single mom because my husband was in Iraq, but it was actually 10 times harder when he returned because we had so much to adjust to and oh by the way I found out I was pregnant during exams and then lost the baby later? And that I did pretty damn well, even without those considerations, so shove it out your ass?

Yeah, didn't think so.

I find this post boring.

I find all the posts I've done on this topic lately boring.

I am boring myself.

I am taking Sunday off and going to a petting zoo with the family and some friends.

That should help.

That ... and a whole bottle of wine.

Note: I signed on to write a totally different post. Then I got kind of pissed off and emotional. So I went with it. PMS I guess.

An OCI tantrum

* a short bout of self indulgent whining ahead ... don't say you weren't warned *

So I am doing OCI, but there are only two firms that come that I really saw myself working at, at least when this process began ... and one I have been particularly enamoured with since early in 1L. I signed up for most firms I thought I could tolerate, if only to hedge my bets.

And because I wasn't expecting much.

As these weeks wore on, I've gotten more callbacks than I anticipated. (Read: Any.) Actually six so far... I guess my "maturity" isn't as big a handicap as career services and some people have lead me to beleive. I've done three of the callbacks so far, but no offers expected til next week at the earliest, so we'll see...)

All of this left me fairly confident that when Favorite Firm came later in the process, I would at least get a callback.

Got the news yesterday.

I didn't.

I cannot understand what I did "wrong" in that interview that the other firms seem to think I did "right." The fact I found out about two other callbacks the same day, at firms most of my friends would kill to get callbacks at, did little to ease the sense of loss.

Ok, so everything happens for a reason.

Maybe I'm supposed to work someplace else that's a better fit -- though I don't see it now.

Maybe I'm supposed to try again next year, especially if where I end up this summer doesn't work out, and I'll appreciate Favorite all the more.

Maybe I said something totally inapproriate during the interview and have suppressed the memory.

Maybe I should shut up and count my blessings.

* Also, hit counter said 28,000 today. Woot.

I am not competant to represent your firm... so am I hired?

I am too imcompetant to be a lawyer.

No one should trust me with a task more challenging than choosing my own socks.

Even then, I might need help.

I am an idiot.

Today was the screening interview for the biggest bestest firm that came to OCI -- the one that had the career services ladies all a-tizzy; let's call them International, Corporate, and Massive.

They were the only outfit interviewing today, or so I thought. So I stood outside the interview room in my little black suit and waited. And waited some more. It wasn't uncommon for these folks to be running late... especially this late in the day.

Ten minutes later, a 3L in a suit comes out. I ask if the interviewer needs a few minutes or should I go in. Reply: Umm, I am the last interview of the day. You must be looking for the interviews in the Lawrary.

FARK!!!!

I sprint to the lawbrary to see an annoyed interviewer heading over to bite the heads off the Career Services ladies (where is my next victim?! you promised fresh blood every half hour!)when he spots me in my suit carrying my leather note pad and running full out in heels. Clickety-clickety on the marble, jacket flying, pudge jiggling.

"Butterflyfish?" he asks. (Sh*t he reads the blog. Kidding)

Me, apologising profusely, feeling like a jackass. He interviewed me anyway, but I didn't recover. I made a few interview faux pas, like lacking a stock answer to a basic question (something like, so why should I hire you and not one of your classmates? Ummm... cuz I'm mature and responsible? The tardiness and blithering notwithstanding?)

In fact, at the end of the interview, he took the time to give me some constructive feedback on things I could have said better.

If I get a callback, I'll take it as a sign of the Apocalypse.

EDITED TO ADD:

Beanie asked if he was being kind or an egomaniac about the feedback.

I'm going to say it was more of the latter. He was a grad from my school (part-timer actually) and my school NEVER gets hired by this firm -- there are only like two laterals. So he's proud of himself for summering there and I get that.

He proceeded to tell me how he stalked them for two years and how if I really had my sites (sights?) set on this firm I should do what he did, which is go back in time, work for Firm Y for 1L summer because Bob the Lawyer would get me an "in" at IC&M for 2L summer. (Signal: because you're not getting a callback to work there this year.)

Oh, and to make sure I had a really solid answer for the question: So, why should we hire you?

(ususally I do... I just flubbed it)

Callback brain

I had my first callback with a firm I sort-of like. "Sort of like" means, if they're my only offer, I'll work there. Because hell, they called me back. They must think I'm special, even though I'm just not that into them.

*sigh* This is why I am glad I am married and don't have to deal with this in my personal life -- this firm is the equivalent of Mr. GoodEnough. It'll never be Mr. Right. I don't like playing these games.

Ok, so I was talking to the third attorney in a row. I was saying pretty much the same things and answering the same lame questions and telling the same lame stories. About 20 minutes in, I had this heart-stopping moment when I realized that the conversation had gone out of sequence and I seriously didn't know if I had already told him "Essential Reason I Am Awesomeness Defined #2."

Its a frightening moment, because when the dialogue leads you right to that point, you want to make it. But if you've already said it, you look ditsy and clueless and socially inept, but if you fail to say it, he doesn't get "Complete Picture of The Awesomeness" ... and you're sitting there drooling and babbling and trying to think of something to say.

I'm calling it Callback Brain.

Anyone have similar stories to share?



Also: Totally unrelated. Clownfish said "I want to wear big boy underpants to school today." He's been nearly trained for a few weeks, but insists on pull-ups still Until today. He wore underwear to school today and had no accidents.

He got his long awaited reward: another train for his Thomas collection. I think it was Murdock.

Next challenge: dry at night.

I want to be just like her

So... after my initial rejection, I've gotten an on-campus interview with everyone else to whom I've applied. Only one call-back so far, but its still early in the process, at least around here.

Yesterday, I interviewed for a government job. One of those "not sure I'm interested but not sure I'm not interested so lets click and see what happens" interviews.

First impressions -- pleasant enough, dressed a little informally, Holy God she smells like cat.

After a few minutes of conversation -- ok, so you have jobs, no funding for jobs, and haven't taken on anyone locally in five years, and you don't expect that to change.

After ten minutes of conversation -- you want to know what area I'm interested in working? Where you have no jobs?

. . .

Twenty five minutes later -- to recap: you nephews wear sneakers that are too expensive, you went to law school to avoid working for your dad's small business, you hate cola, and you think this generation of law students are fools to go anywhere but Ivy league/T-14 schools even though you went to a school that no longer exists and you were pretty sure Princeton had a good law school.

Line of the day from one of my classmates:

A: How did your interview with [government agency] go?

B: Did you ever sit next to the crazy cat lady who rides the bus? I think it was her.

Things I should not say out loud

Why do you want to be a lawyer?

I definitely like being a law student. I'm not sure about being a lawyer yet. Many lawyers are assholes. I definitely don't want to be one of those. But then, many law students are assholes too, and I've managed to avoid being one of those. So we'll see.

Why do you want to work in this firm?

I don't. You're a practice interview.

Why did you leave teaching?

Because I took it home with me every day. I cried every day in my last job. Working with troubled kids exacerbated my depression. I couldn't do that anymore.

Did you always want to be a lawyer?

Ever since I saw Ally McBeal. Did you know as a lawyer you can sing in bars and defend guys who believe in unicorns? Seems like a totally awesome job!


(Ok, that last one is totally untrue. But you know how you have totally inapproriate responses in your head sometimes, and it takes a force of will to avoid saying it? This is what I avoided blurting out today.)

Rejection

Live blogging a moment here, so these feelings will probably cease to be relevant in about an hour.

Butterflyfish, (yes, they know my name at CSO)

I'm sorry to inform you that you have not been selected for an interview with White Corporate & Male LLP.

Take Care,
Mr. Sensitive, Career Services Office

My school doesn't do a lottery system or early interviews or anything that I've learned about talking to students higher in the USNWR ranking foodchain. For OCI, we submit resumes (and whatever else the firm wants) through a website and we wait to see if we're pre-selected for on-campus screening interviews. Then there are callbacks, etc.

I've gotten two acceptances so far. This is my first rejection.

Its a weird moment for me -- I've sent out resumes before for jobs -- probably hundreds over the years, when applying for teaching jobs as I moved around the country. But when I cast my net wide and got nary a nibble, there was no sting to it. Maybe I told myself they weren't rejecting me, they just didn't have any jobs available, or maybe they wanted someone with more experience. Something, anyway, that didn't make the process feel so personal.

Here, it feels a little like a mafia slaying -- get up close and stab in the heart; read the resume, and reject you personally. Its you I don't want, not merely someone like you with a similar qualification set. You -- your grades, your experience, your writing. It is all substandard in our eyes and you may be able to make a living as a lawyer, but we think you should maybe go elsewhere. Be gone!

While I am sure my resume was dropped into the shredder hundreds of times before now, I never really knew or felt it.

This stings.



Perspective. . . and I do have some:

Will I get rejected dozens of times in the process of looking for a job in the next few year? Of course.

Am I going to cry about it? Eh, to be brutally honest, maybe. Depends on the situtation. Certainly not over this one -- a firm for which I knew going in I didn't have the "numbers" and didn't have any particular burning desire to work for.

Will I eventually find some work that makes me happy? I am optimistic.

Write on approaches

If Fox is correct, I'd really better ace the write on.

Also, I need a joke ... other than my Contracts grade.

4th of July randomness

I haven't seen any fireworks yet this year. And I probably won't see any tonight.

My neighbors really had a blast setting off illegal-loud-banging-firecrackers 12 feet from my sleeping child's window last night. Bastards.

One of the first blogs I read before I started law school is back. She was writing about the Bar then. She is writing about her life now. A lot can happen in a year, and she has one of my favorite voices in the sphere. Welcome back WWFD.

I am linking also to an old post of hers because it is essential that I prepare to be ignored during OCI.

Speaking of OCI, my fellow summers from Ivy League Law are getting ready for OCI by preparing spreadsheets during their downtime. Huge, detailed spreadsheets. I hear them muttering about prestige ratings and number of partners devoted to x practice and billables and minimum GPAs. Since there are many fewer firms coming to my school, and even fewer that I might actually be interested in, I don't think I need a spreadsheet. Back of an envelope should do just fine.

I like my summer job more than I thought I would but I am pretty sure I would not dig it or the commute every day if it were my real life. I had that thought this morning while blissfully not commuting.